Discussion in 'Questions about David' started by carmel59, Aug 25, 2014.

  1. carmel59

    carmel59 Well-Known Grayhead

    I would love to hear from all you long-time, die-hard fans your opinion on Babylon.

    First off, I've never been a fan of Babylon. It never really grabbed me. Although I do enjoy the accoustic version.

    Is it time to hang up that song? Replace it with some of the rarities we never hear? ( I would love to hear Freedom.).......... I get the feeling DG is a bit weary of it. Is there ever a concert where he doesn't do it? I've been just waiting for it to happen to see how the audience reacts. Maybe it would be better if it was brought out on occasion to make it special again. Like a surprise.........everyone wondering when he'll do Babylon again.

    Or is Babylon too sacred to mess with?:confused:
  2. RosalieEP

    RosalieEP Well-Known Grayhead

    Ha! I'm tired of it, but actually, it is the song that introduced me to DG in the first place. I owe it that!

    I wouldn't mind it disappearing from setlists, but really, I'm reminded that it's the song most of the people came to see. I went to the last show with a friend who only knew White Ladder, and she loved hearing it. That, TYL and Sail Away I'm tired of, but those were songs she would have been disappointed not to hear. As it was, she said she'd love to see him again anytime and she has since been listening to Mutineers. I was reminded that there are many types of good fans, not just crazies like me!
    highaltitude and carmel59 like this.
  3. carmel59

    carmel59 Well-Known Grayhead

    Yes, new fans would miss those songs you mentioned. But, I do wish it wasn't every concert. Sail Away hasn't worn me out yet. Especially when he mixes up the rhythms and arrangements.
  4. RosalieEP

    RosalieEP Well-Known Grayhead

    Each concert is someone's first or only concert, though. In my mind, I've *ONLY* seen him five times, but when I tell this to others, they laugh at my obsession to have gone to see someone *FIVE* times!

    Anyway, in spirit, I absolutely agree with you that I could name dozens of gems I have yet to hear that I'd put in the White Ladder's holy trinity's place in a heartbeat, but I have to remember I'm the oddball in those thousands of people attending.
    wolfie and carmel59 like this.
  5. wolfie

    wolfie Well-Known Grayhead

    First - full disclosure that Babylon has never been one of my favorite David Gray songs. I was no more excited to hear it at my first show than I will be to hear it at my 100th show next month. That said, I do understand that it is a favorite of many of David's fans and I fully respect that. Therefore, I completely get where you're coming from, Rosalie. I agree with much of what you said in that regard. While I cringe a bit inside every time it's played I also smile because of the reaction it usually elicits from the crowd. Its ability to excite even the most passive crowd cannot be denied. The problem with continuing to play it every night year after year, however, is that you continue that expectation that it's going to be played and, therefore, you have to keep playing it forever. Or risk disappointing a lot of people. I agree with you, carmel59, that it would be more special to play it more occasionally. As far as the other two songs in the "White Ladder holy trinity," TYL and Sail Away, I view them the same way. Their continued presence on the setlist every night reads more old era than new era to me. However, I do get that they are beloved crowd pleasers and David wants a happy customer. And, from my perspective, seeing someone's reaction at hearing it for the first time is very sweet. On a personal level I could do without hearing Babylon (or TYL or Sail Away) ever again, but to echo what Rosalie said- I know that makes me an oddball in a crowd of thousands. And to echo what I've said before -I feel very fortunate to be at any show I am at and I am happy to hear anything and everything that gets played.
  6. carmel59

    carmel59 Well-Known Grayhead

    Rosalie, if you're an oddball, I'm an oddball, Oddballs Unite!! Wolfie, maybe there's more oddballs out there than we realize.

    I've only seen him thee times. It'll be 4 in October. Hasn't been near enough now that I know who he is. I really like variety and surprise. I guess thats why this Babylon thing wears on me a bit. His repertoire is so deep.

    Wolfie, 100 shows!!!! I want to be you!!! You should be celebrated somehow!!! Is there anyone else that's seen that many shows?

    I was hoping to hear your opinion on this subject. I love a good discussion and to hear everyones' point of view.
    RosalieEP likes this.
  7. wolfie

    wolfie Well-Known Grayhead

    I feel the same way so I know where you are coming from. I do!! It breaks my heart a little that there are beautiful and amazing songs that go unsung while Babylon (and TYL and Sail Way) get sung every (or very nearly every) show. But then I go back to the point about it being someone's first and maybe only David Gray show and she is dying to hear it and will be crushed if she doesn't. I try very hard to view it from that perspective even though it's so different from mine. I would be a liar, though, if I said I didn't wish other songs could be played instead - not because I don't value Babylon/TYL/Sail but because I also value all of his other songs and wish so much for them to be played and heard and appreciated.
    Haha, yeah, oddballs unite! :)
    carmel59 likes this.
  8. carmel59

    carmel59 Well-Known Grayhead

    you're a generous person Wolfie.........well said.
  9. davidcotyalex

    davidcotyalex Well-Known Grayhead

    purists and poppeye ****

    as i said long ago use the opportunity of babylon to go the restroom or get a drink...............easy as that

    or as has been the case of late for me get re-energized into the song and have fun with the banter................if this song didn't move you from the first time you heard it you should have your head examined............ummm sorry but babylon is quintessential DG it is heard in walgreens it is the first connection any common joe has to his music and you are going to discount its relevance its quality its meaning as a song not only to the audience but to the public???!

    and then suggest he doesn't play the only song that one of the greatest music historians ever to grace this planet in Dave Wibberley as the only song he likes of the catalog in Sail Away??!!! (notwithstanding that moment in luzern when he looked me squarely in the eye on the "drunken idiot" line???!!)

    and this years love and deprive coty and I all the moments over the last 62.5 or whatever the hell shows it is (not quite up to wolfie epicness granted lol) loving hating pushing groping yelling kissing through all these years with that song???!!


    because you want to hear Tidal Wave lol??!!

    let's stick with the program kids and love the gems that he throws................the man needs to make a living ya know?!

    all my love................and am waiting on the email YOU!

  10. wolfie

    wolfie Well-Known Grayhead

    Who did that?!?

    Not particularly.

    Yeah, I know. Think I'm doing my part to help in that regard....
    carmel59 likes this.
  11. davidcotyalex

    davidcotyalex Well-Known Grayhead

    no email..........

    No. NO.

  12. davidcotyalex

    davidcotyalex Well-Known Grayhead

    those questioning the craziness of not including it in the setlist

    you are not going to get gems for stalwarts please get that through the head!

    happy to consult on a psychological basis as needed :)
  13. carmel59

    carmel59 Well-Known Grayhead

    too many words

    it was just a light hearted question, not an existential analysis of people who go to DG concerts.

    when you grind something into the ground it just seems to me it gets a little less special.

    I'm writing all this with a grin on my face, because you fell right into my provocation;)
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2014
  14. carmel59

    carmel59 Well-Known Grayhead

    Name names man!!!! don't beat around the bush!!!
  15. Susanne

    Susanne New Grayhead

    I love hearing the less mainstream stuff live, but what Rosalie said is what I try to remember. Also, Babylon is good fun to sing along to. He did a great job using that song to engage the crowd in Portland a few days back. It was just a big 'ol singalong.
    RosalieEP and carmel59 like this.

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